We need to get people to understand that hatred of gay men is misandry in the same way hatred of lesbians is regarded by many as being an aspect of misogyny. 



  1. Actually, I think that hatred of gay men is also an aspect of misogyny, or more properly an aspect of patriarchy. The main reason that male homosexuality is so threatening to traditional males is that it denies the patriarchal definition of the roles of the sexes.

  2. I know more women who are homophobic than I know men who are homophobic. Patriarchy is not a male thing only, as any observent member of the Church of England knows only too well.

    But my point is that lesbians got a lot of useful mileage out of linking their campaign to feminism early on. Now, if you hate lesbians you hate women. The insistence of viewing gay men as a third sex has removed them from their physical gender in a way lesbians have managed to avoid due to their insistence on being women. This has made it easier for men and women (straight and gay) to attack gay men with less of a guilty conscience then they would have attacking lesbians.

  3. I always thought it was because straight men find male-male sex “icky” and female-female sex “hot”.

    I have found very few women to be as homophobic as men.

    Additionally, there is a real streak of anti-women views in some of the gay community. I have some wonderful gay male friends, but I have also met some gay guys who REALLY dislike women and gay women more than all.

    So there is plenty to go around.

    I do believe with Bill that heterosexism is but one facet of sexism generally.

  4. It must be an English thing then, IT. Perhaps, as England is so well renowned for it’s witty, good looking “queers,” our womenfolk are scared that all their men will be “turned.” But seriously, most of the UK’s really outspoken homophobes are either female (and religious, unfortunately) or the Archbishop of Canterbury. Fortunately, these people are generally regarded as completely bonkers as homophobia is well and truly non-PC in the UK now. I’m not including Roman Catholic bishops in the above statement, but then they’re not really British.

  5. I know more women who are homophobic than I know men who are homophobic.

    That is not at all my experience. I find men to be much more homophobic. Of course, this sort of observation is subjective and anecdotal.

    But my point is that lesbians got a lot of useful mileage out of linking their campaign to feminism early on.

    Maybe gay men could get a lot of useful mileage from linking their campaign to feminism. (Just kidding!)

    My Thought for the Day:

    The roots of homophobia are complex and do not fit well into a ‘Thought for the Day.’

  6. Of course, I know a lot more grumpy old women than I know grumpy old men.

    This Thought for Today has nothing to do with the roots of homophobia (which, if you had read it you would have realised for yourself). But please, carry on with your knee jerk reactions if it makes you feel comfortable. Far be it from me to challenge all your pre-conceived stereotypes.

  7. Joe.My.God. posts many stories about obnoxiously homophobic women (which then usually provokes the gay men to respont “C*nt!” in a flurry of the misogyny that IT remarks about).

    I generally think these women tend to be “fronts” for overwhelmingly male homophobic organizations. OCICBW. [And I agree w/ Bill G.]

    …well, I do think that homophobia in minority communities here in the US may be more of a female phenomena. In the African-American and Latino communities (esp. among the economically disempowered), there’s a real sense of a “male shortage” (w/ so many deceased, in prison, or in the prison of addiction pathology). Minority women, then, perceive male homosexuality as “straw that broke the camel’s back” (esp. when they find out that handsome guy they have their eye on is into other guys). This combines w/ the idea that “homosexuality is a white plot” paranoia (of the sort we see in Africa). Hence, that @sshole NY Senator Ruben Diaz can get a big homophobic turn-out of angry churchwomen…

  8. I know many more homophobic men than homophobic women, but the really interesting thing is that they all hate gays more than they hate lesbians.

    I think it’s partly because women are generally more touchy feely anyway, so we don’t think anything about seeing women walk arm in arm, kissing goodbyes, that kind of thing.

    And lesbian sex isn’t real in most people’s eyes, no sex is real until it involves penetration of some kind.
    We’re far less of a threat.

    Men tend to take it more personally that we’ve rejected them, but as IT says, girl and girl sex is a staple fantasy.

  9. It may well be true that some aspects of how people respond to other genders and sexualities is not cultural, but the percentage is likely low. So variances even in the prejudices is hardly surprising.


  10. I generally think these women tend to be “fronts” for overwhelmingly male homophobic organizations.

    Of course, if you are right, JCF, it means that lots of women are basically gullible fools. Perhaps women shouldn’t be given positions of responsibility. Fortunately, I don’t believe that. But that means that I refuse to let women like Erika and IT pass the buck whenever it suits them.

    By the way, I often have gay dreams and I often have straight dreams. But I never have lesbian dreams. I wouldn’t be at all surprised if I am not unusual in this respect. I think the male lesbian fantasy is a feminist fantasy.

  11. MP luv, you’re one of the least “typically straight” men I know * (virtually or IRL).

    [* Meant as a compliment, meant as a compliment!]

  12. Well then, Rick. There’s no way you could complete the Sainsbury’s survey. Which means you won’t get your 25 free Nectar points.

  13. “I think the male lesbian fantasy is a feminist fantasy.”

    It’s a staple of porn websites and they’re not known to be produced for feminists.