By the way, I watched a fantastic documentary last night on the decline of Detroit. What I was particularly struck by was the way the people have just started to do things for themselves now that the bosses have cleared off. The urban farms on waste ground are interesting and similar to the ones in Cuba that have saved the Cubans from starvation. I'm beginning to get an idea about "emergent" not being strictly a church thing, or even Christian thing. Maybe it's a new universal zeitgeist. The bosses, in politics, business and religion have let us down big time recently and capitalism has lost all claims to being our "saviour." Is the next shift in society a real move to "bottom up" paradigms? What part will the internet play in this? Can the emergent church (the bit based on liberation theology not evangelical leadership models) be a major player in this - even an initiator? Is it the answer to the current stalemate in Anglicanism - e.g. should progressives and radicals just, unilaterally, move away from the centralist, controlling "instruments," ignore them, and make new alignments with anybody who is committed to the upside down way of doing things? This would fit in with my idea of "true, universal humanism" - in which believers and non-believers alike could get together to sort out the mess without either feeling threatened by the other?